What's the deal with Champion of the Silver Flame?

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typh00nchicken
Posts: 35

What's the deal with Champion of the Silver Flame?

Post#1 » Mon Nov 13, 2017 10:35 am

Almost every build I see on nwn2db has ppl taking CoSF after 8 levels of pally. Every time I test a build such as this, though, I'm forced to take 10 levels of pally. What gives?

adam
Posts: 464

Re: What's the deal with Champion of the Silver Flame?

Post#2 » Mon Nov 13, 2017 11:55 am

your wisdom is probably too low. The ability to cast Angelskin(or something like that) is required. try equipping a piece of gear. If memory serves, you need 12+ wisdom to take CotSF levels. I

typh00nchicken
Posts: 35

Re: What's the deal with Champion of the Silver Flame?

Post#3 » Mon Nov 13, 2017 12:17 pm

Yeah, I checked that too. Had it start with 12 Wis (Angelskin is a level 2 pally spell). It still failed. Anyhow....here's the build I was working at:

http://nwn2db.com/build/?278807

Anyone care to input on how something like this might fare in RoT?

Fraggle
Posts: 26

Re: What's the deal with Champion of the Silver Flame?

Post#4 » Mon Nov 13, 2017 2:09 pm

First at all i am not an expert of Pala/CotSF builds.
When ist possible 8 Pala/12 CotSF is better ( Pala Purist feat, which allows to take Epic Divine Shield, should be 65 Percent Concealment ).

General, think Ftr 18/2 EA could be better too ( i dont remember Feature you can pick with 18 Ftr ).

Your actual build has no uncanny Dodge. Could be Suicide for a Dexbuild.

Whats with 18 Ftr/ 2 SD, for Hips, Evasion ( allows to take Elusive Archery ) and uncanny Dodge.
I dont know if the Hips and Manyshot mechanic works well together with Epic Divine Shield.

And at least, when Hips mechanic together with DS works, maybe your Weapon is not the best.
AC should be high enough and defensive General for Longbow. Slings means more AC ( you can equip Shield ) but lesser Damage, excpept you are an owner of an excellent DM Sling.

typh00nchicken
Posts: 35

Re: What's the deal with Champion of the Silver Flame?

Post#5 » Mon Nov 13, 2017 2:33 pm

Fraggle wrote:First at all i am not an expert of Pala/CotSF builds.
When ist possible 8 Pala/12 CotSF is better ( Pala Purist feat, which allows to take Epic Divine Shield, should be 65 Percent Concealment ).

General, think Ftr 18/2 EA could be better too ( i dont remember Feature you can pick with 18 Ftr ).

Your actual build has no uncanny Dodge. Could be Suicide for a Dexbuild.

Whats with 18 Ftr/ 2 SD, for Hips, Evasion ( allows to take Elusive Archery ) and uncanny Dodge.
I dont know if the Hips and Manyshot mechanic works well together with Epic Divine Shield.

And at least, when Hips mechanic together with DS works, maybe your Weapon is not the best.
AC should be high enough and defensive General for Longbow. Slings means more AC ( you can equip Shield ) but lesser Damage, excpept you are an owner of an excellent DM Sling.


Pala purist feat? Is that in the wiki?

Fraggle
Posts: 26

Re: What's the deal with Champion of the Silver Flame?

Post#6 » Mon Nov 13, 2017 3:33 pm

Pala Purist is described at Trinity Library, CotSF Class description is granted at lvl 12, allows to pick Epic Divine Shield.

Forgot earlier 1 important remark, when you build this on easy Mode, you get 5 Ability Points more.
You could hit than 21 Str/38 Dex/ 28 Cha base stats, better Saves, more Damage and longer Duration of DM, DS.
Think its worth to build EDM on easy Mode.

typh00nchicken
Posts: 35

Re: What's the deal with Champion of the Silver Flame?

Post#7 » Mon Nov 13, 2017 3:46 pm

Fraggle wrote:Pala Purist is described at Trinity Library, CotSF Class description is granted at lvl 12, allows to pick Epic Divine Shield.

Forgot earlier 1 important remark, when you build this on easy Mode, you get 5 Ability Points more.
You could hit than 21 Str/38 Dex/ 28 Cha base stats, better Saves, more Damage and longer Duration of DM, DS.
Think its worth to build EDM on easy Mode.


What's the difference between easy and normal modes

typh00nchicken
Posts: 35

Re: What's the deal with Champion of the Silver Flame?

Post#8 » Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:16 pm

Fraggle wrote:Pala Purist is described at Trinity Library, CotSF Class description is granted at lvl 12, allows to pick Epic Divine Shield.

Forgot earlier 1 important remark, when you build this on easy Mode, you get 5 Ability Points more.
You could hit than 21 Str/38 Dex/ 28 Cha base stats, better Saves, more Damage and longer Duration of DM, DS.
Think its worth to build EDM on easy Mode.


Feats were a problem, though.

See here for easy mode version:

http://nwn2db.com/build/?278829

kc2345
Posts: 499

Re: What's the deal with Champion of the Silver Flame?

Post#9 » Mon Nov 13, 2017 7:25 pm

Don't forget that 13 levels of Paladin or Fighter qualify for Epic Stoicism (+6 Str), so Cha can cap out 6 points higher.

Paladins get full CL progression based on what I've heard (might want to verify), meaning taking Practiced Caster would net another +1 AB from bless.

Could swap the 2 Great Charisma feats for Practiced Caster and Expert Tactician, or get a Belt of the Tormites.

Edit:
Longbow would put you at low mid 100s AC, meaning you have to play evasively with HiPS against late game enemies. Enemy archers can tear you apart.

Sling would be low mid 110s, so you can stand your ground for some time, but you lose significant damage from a poorer base weapon, 2 AB due to missing out on Artemis runeword, and from ER3 adamantite not stacking with the enhancement bonus - due to the bludgeoning subtype.

So both choices are viable - it's a tradeoff between AC and damage.
Image

Fraggle
Posts: 26

Re: What's the deal with Champion of the Silver Flame?

Post#10 » Tue Nov 14, 2017 9:19 am

KC described it well, Epic Stoicism gives +6 Str, so i would try to hit Base ( at DB Builder) Str 15/ Dex 38/ Cha 28.
Should be possible with Asimar, alternative would be Yuan Ti, but you should than lvl different to avoid XP Penalty while leveling and at Lvl 40 you can relevel to your Optimum Build.
Your actual Build has Con to low for my Taste.

All in all, your Build now is the better way compared to your first i think.
You can test which playing Style you prefer, Sling or Longbow.

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